An Interview with Phil
From “Saxaholic” Sax on the Web Forum Columnist 9/2011
Q: So, everyone starts at the beginning, might as well do it here, too. How did you get into mouthpiece refacing, and secondly, mouthpiece design?
A: I have always been the type of person who wants to know the intricate details of my interests. Additionally, I’ve also had the tendency to be unable to leave things alone. Playing the saxophone led to the horns inevitable disassembly. Playing the mouthpieces led to sandpaper and files.
Sensible players swap one mouthpiece for another in order to arrive at a musical destination. In my general failure to be rational, I began toying with baffles, chamber sizes, and facing lengths to achieve that end. My goal was never to reface mouthpieces, simply to correct them. Corrections were just part of the path to have the piece behave in the way I wanted.
Q: If it wasn’t that much of a goal, when did you decide this might become a business for you? Was there a defining moment when you decided to reface and design mouthpieces?
A: Even after selling to a few pro players early in my finishing career, the thought of this being a viable business was little more than a fantasy…if that. Honestly, my venture in this arena was a series of loosely connected experiences. These eventually culminated in the realization that I had created something beyond my original intent.
If there was a defining moment it would have to be the mouthpiece pass around at Sax on the Web and having the pieces marketed through Dave Hoskins at Junkdude. This was the first time I had made a concerted and conscious effort to move the products into the market place. That would be the proverbial “jump in with both feet” and hope for the best. From that point the business has grown though the forum and by word of mouth from many points on the globe. Thus far the brand has never engaged commercial advertisement.
Q: That is impressive, to say the least. One of the major things brought up about your mouthpieces is that they’re so affordable; obviously the money isn’t your motivation. What drives you to produce such high-quality mouthpieces at such low prices?
A: I strive to maintain a price point the majority of players can afford. I’m not interested in collectors and I’m not interested in making jewelry. Artists require access. I went into this business to provide access. I did not, nor do I still, believe that the cost of a quality mouthpiece should equal a mortgage payment. This is something I feel very strongly about.
In terms of quality I will always work to the best of my skills for those who make music in this world. It doesn’t matter if you are a student or a pro. Making music is an essential part of life and it is important. Any money I make is intended to be a small amount for the time I put into each mouthpiece. The reward is in customers who come back year after year. Their trust is the real reward as are the letters and sound clips players send. You see, I have a really privileged position; I get to be a small part of all these peoples music.
Q: It has to be a great thing to appreciate; being part of so much music. What was the biggest thing you started to appreciate when you began refacing?
A: Sadly, I started to really appreciate when I found a well made mouthpiece. It’s amazing how many players use substandard gear. While a good player can make nearly any setup sound good it takes so much more work. Our gear should get out of the way but so often it presents unnecessary obstacles and the player is pitted against his or her own equipment.
Q: Man vs. Mouthpiece. Sounds like a reality series. So here’s another inevitable question. What is your view on mouthpiece materials? (Laughing as Phil’s face grimaces at the question)
A: This debate will likely persist as long as people are playing the saxophone. In my opinion, most of the time, the importance of material is exaggerated. This is due to unsubstantiated claims frequently designed to exact more dollars from unsuspecting players. That is not to say that it makes no difference in the making of a mouthpiece. There are some hard rubber compounds that are a pleasure to craft while others are terrible. For example, due to an unavoidable supply side issue, several years of Meyers were made from rather poor grades of hard rubber. Working on a mouthpiece made in that era is like refacing an old tire. They play fine but the work is difficult and unpleasant.
In the world of metal mouthpieces, I fail to understand why “silverite” was ever chosen to make a serious mouthpiece. It pits and literally disintegrates with use. On the opposite end of the spectrum I feel that makers that utilize stainless steel should be obligated to pass government engineering standards prior to production. Obviously I’m joking here but it is a real shame how many potentially great mouthpieces become doorstops by virtue of them being machined in a material so unreasonable to hand craft.
Q: Well we know one maker of silverite who wasn’t your main influence. Did you actually have influences in the mouthpiece world? If so, who and why?
A: Yes. Without a doubt I would have to say Ralph Morgan. He was not so much an influence in the way I make or design a piece but rather in what he stood for. Morgan was a man walking around with so much history and information and he openly shared it. Anyone who ever had a conversation about mouthpieces with Ralph knew the passion he had for his work. He didn’t try to mystify, instead he educated. If that were not enough his craft was amazing and the cost of his pieces were tailored to the man on the street.
Q: He is definitely missed. Had his idea of what he wanted in mouthpieces and the knowledge to do it. What different elements do you find important in a mouthpiece?
A: First and foremost a mouthpiece should be enjoyable. A player should want to play it more in order to explore its possibilities. There are number of elements that facilitate this. A mouthpiece has to have core and a lot of it. This is a constant. It can present itself as spread or focused, bright or dark. Regardless, core, complexity, and depth are critical. If you have core you have something to shape and mold into whatever you want. A mouthpiece should also have a broad dynamic range and ease of response.
A piece should also be controllable. No one likes a stuffy mouthpiece, but a measured amount of resistance (many call it good resistance) aids in control and keeps a piece from breaking up when it is pushed. It should permit finesse as well as the ability to open up and blow down the walls if and when needed.
A mouthpiece should have the ability to become “invisible” to the players concept. A mouthpiece with one persistent voice drowns expression. A truly great mouthpiece helps a student to sound better while allowing advanced players to musically explore without imposed limits.
Q: It’s tough sometimes to know if a mouthpiece is going to “limit” a player or not. Speaking of which, one of the things I like on your Introduction page mentions that CNC machines can’t play test their own work. Does that mean you play-test every single mouthpiece you create to make sure it’s not going to be limiting to the player?
A: Absolutely. Making a mouthpiece is more than just a numbers game. A mouthpiece is an extremely complex beast. So many variables interact to create the playing experience. This being the case, it is only logical that certain elements of a mouthpiece can only be experienced and accounted for though thorough play testing. No mouthpiece leaves this shop without being played. This will not change.
Q: So you get to play-test all of your work; with that in mind, what is your personal favorite out of all the mouthpieces you make? Why?
A: For alto my favorite is by far the Solstice. This piece has started to catch on over the past six months. As you know the piece was originally designed for the West Coast vibe of Desmond and Pepper. However, it didn’t take long to realize that it can cover so much more territory. What began as a concept for a niche piece has given way to a piece allowing for musical expression that is outside the typical alto/Meyer rig. I have had the pleasure of hearing it used with a number of setups by accomplished players. Each of them found ways of incorporating it differently into their music. That is a very exciting thing to experience as a maker.
Without a doubt my favorite tenor mouthpiece is the Equinox. I probably have about 80 mouthpieces in the shop right now. I can play anything but this is the piece I reach for. I didn’t realize this until I shipped you the prototype for review. When I was without the piece I found that I really didn’t play. Nothing I put on my horn seemed to satisfy. The Equinox does everything I ask it to do and it fits my personal sound concept more than any piece I’ve made or played. While I like the Eclipse (the original Phil-Tone Tenor) and think it’s a tremendous mouthpiece I must admit that I have found more enjoyment in what others have done with it musically.
Q: What sound concept did you have in mind for your new Equinox tenor mouthpiece?
A: There is an old saying among sculptors; they say the sculpture already exists in the stone; it is simply the job of the artist to find it. You might say the same for the Equinox. I remember getting the rough sample blanks. I played the blank first which was of course abysmal but necessary to know your point of departure. The remainder was simply a logical progression (at least logical to me at the time) from Point A to Point E. I did not start with a preconceived notion of what I wanted but rather, I worked with the piece as it evolved into its final form. The creative process is something that you allow to happen. The imposition of will ends discovery.
Q: So that is your own design, but you also enhance existing mouthpieces. Your Custom Meyer alto mouthpieces, in particular, have gained a large following recently; what do you think makes yours so different from all the other “perfected” Meyers?
A: From a subjective standpoint I believe the current Meyer design to be inherently flawed. The primary culprit besides factory finishing issues is the prominent and early introduction of a squeeze in the throat. That is why it is altered in every Meyer I make. When you look at the old Meyer Brothers French blank the squeeze is further back. This changes the airflow, presents a slightly larger chamber and provides for a warmer, larger, and more pleasing tone. It is no secret what I do to a mouthpiece. It’s all right there to see. As mouthpiece makers or finishers we all hear and consider tone from a subjective standpoint. This is my interpretation of a Meyer and I’m grateful they are appreciated.
Q: Well, it’s been great talking with you, Phil. One final question. What would be your first recommendation for anyone trying out your mouthpieces?
A: Play them for more than ten minutes. (Laughing) No, seriously, I’ve had quite a few customers call me and say “I sold that piece of yours, and never should have, can you make me another one?” So my advice is to always take your time with a new mouthpiece and play it for a while; it really lets you explore the different possibilities each mouthpiece presents.